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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2014 0:24:53 GMT -1
This is it for me - this is why I am contributing to this thread.... I have two young daughters, they are both extremely gifted and talented and part of that is because we've encouraged them to fulfill their potential but we could do more and here is my struggle, both born in the UK but if I decide to vote for Indy, will I come to regret it and feel that I've let them down? Will I vote for the status quo and come to regret it and feel I've let them down. My trouble is, I'm quite a simpleton, I want it easy, I want it clear, concise and factual - this is what WILL happen if we leave and this is what WILL happen if we stay.It's quite a heavy burden, it's not one that I take lightly and it's one that actually bothers me a lot. It's not my future that I worry about but those of my two beautiful wee girls... I don't want to betray them and I want them to have the best opportunities in life and Rolo, I know you'll tell me that's with an Independent Scotland but I'm still uncertain and time is marching on, September will be upon us, in not time! Gilly, we both know fine well there's no certainties in life! As parents, we just try to make our best calls for our children. There are no guarantees with Independence-- just as there are no guarantees with the (current) status quo. Whatever you decide on the Indy question, you'll hardly be 'betraying' your girls. You'll make a considered decision, driven by your desire for their welfare, above all else. That's really the best any of us can do, I think.
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Post by ozneil on Jan 30, 2014 0:30:39 GMT -1
We are expecting an upsurge in migration applications after referendum from UK.
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Post by notanimby on Jan 30, 2014 6:18:20 GMT -1
I think that part of the problem is the media treatment of our destiny, be that as an Independent country or remaining part of the United Kingdom. Today's historic (was it really?) meeting with the Bank of England's Governor has clearly blown the 'No Campaign' out of the water for there was nothing said by the Governor that 'we' couldn't keep the Pound. However, it would 'he' reckons require us to forfeit some fiscal autonomy over 'taxation and interest rates'. I merely posted this because it is quite clear that the undecided like me, are being fed tosh, whilst there are others who provide more complex and academic responses, some of them too long to read, some too difficult to comprehend. And so the Scottish public are getting the snippets, some will be of value somewhere, some won't but it doesn't help any of us really, does it? After today's meeting with Eck and The Gov - my initial thought was 'well what's the point of splitting?' If I am asking that question, how many others are? I'm really struggling, I've read what I am able to read, when I am able to read it. I've been through the White Document, I've read some of the online links you folks have posted and yet, in my gut, I'm still undecided and that is most unlike me. This is it for me - this is why I am contributing to this thread.... I have two young daughters, they are both extremely gifted and talented and part of that is because we've encouraged them to fulfill their potential but we could do more and here is my struggle, both born in the UK but if I decide to vote for Indy, will I come to regret it and feel that I've let them down? Will I vote for the status quo and come to regret it and feel I've let them down. My trouble is, I'm quite a simpleton, I want it easy, I want it clear, concise and factual - this is what WILL happen if we leave and this is what WILL happen if we stay. It's quite a heavy burden, it's not one that I take lightly and it's one that actually bothers me a lot. It's not my future that I worry about but those of my two beautiful wee girls... I don't want to betray them and I want them to have the best opportunities in life and Rolo, I know you'll tell me that's with an Independent Scotland but I'm still uncertain and time is marching on, September will be upon us, in not time! Yes indeed your thoughts on yesterday's meeting are indeed likely true. BAsically Carney said -sort it oot amongst yerselves, the BOE will help yooz implment whutever ye come up way - efter all that's oor job Some things missing from it all though was - what happens to rUK if there's no currency union, will Scotland have to bail out rUK when their economy goes tits up - their debt is currently at @£1.4TRILLION
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2014 19:55:58 GMT -1
I think that part of the problem is the media treatment of our destiny, be that as an Independent country or remaining part of the United Kingdom. Today's historic (was it really?) meeting with the Bank of England's Governor has clearly blown the 'No Campaign' out of the water for there was nothing said by the Governor that 'we' couldn't keep the Pound. However, it would 'he' reckons require us to forfeit some fiscal autonomy over 'taxation and interest rates'. I merely posted this because it is quite clear that the undecided like me, are being fed tosh, whilst there are others who provide more complex and academic responses, some of them too long to read, some too difficult to comprehend. And so the Scottish public are getting the snippets, some will be of value somewhere, some won't but it doesn't help any of us really, does it? After today's meeting with Eck and The Gov - my initial thought was 'well what's the point of splitting?' If I am asking that question, how many others are? I'm really struggling, I've read what I am able to read, when I am able to read it. I've been through the White Document, I've read some of the online links you folks have posted and yet, in my gut, I'm still undecided and that is most unlike me. This is it for me - this is why I am contributing to this thread.... I have two young daughters, they are both extremely gifted and talented and part of that is because we've encouraged them to fulfill their potential but we could do more and here is my struggle, both born in the UK but if I decide to vote for Indy, will I come to regret it and feel that I've let them down? Will I vote for the status quo and come to regret it and feel I've let them down. My trouble is, I'm quite a simpleton, I want it easy, I want it clear, concise and factual - this is what WILL happen if we leave and this is what WILL happen if we stay. It's quite a heavy burden, it's not one that I take lightly and it's one that actually bothers me a lot. It's not my future that I worry about but those of my two beautiful wee girls... I don't want to betray them and I want them to have the best opportunities in life and Rolo, I know you'll tell me that's with an Independent Scotland but I'm still uncertain and time is marching on, September will be upon us, in not time! Yes indeed your thoughts on yesterday's meeting are indeed likely true. BAsically Carney said -sort it oot amongst yerselves, the BOE will help yooz implment whutever ye come up way - efter all that's oor job Some things missing from it all though was - what happens to rUK if there's no currency union, will Scotland have to bail out rUK when their economy goes tits up - their debt is currently at @£1.4TRILLIONI'd add to Nota's point: at no stage has the YES campaign denied our fair share of the national debt. So let's be clear about that. However, what the NO campaign continues to ignore (publically) is that the Scottish people, by dint of contributions over the years, owns roughly 10% of ALL UKE ASSETS. This FACT is also roundly ignored by deeply ignorant people in rUK who continue to insist that England subsidises Scotland. This deeply misguided view seems horribly prominent in rUK but it's just not supported by the Westminster governments own figures.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2014 19:52:53 GMT -1
Just to get back on some sort of even keel, can we continue the indy debate here and not on the Salmond v Cameron thread, that started off specifically about Cameron's refusal to debate with Salmond.
So while it's relevant to the bigger picture, Indy's about much, MUCH more than that single issue.
The PR battle's raging, none more so than in this past week.
I have to say, I've been taken aback by the extent of the vicious, disrespectful anti-Scottish views oh so visible on certain news sites that allow unmoderated comment. In particular the BBC and of course, the Daily Fail.
It's crystal clear to me that a section of the UK population isn't as well informed of the facts as it might be and still continue to insist the Scots get 'handouts' from England.
There's also a seemingly prevalent opinion that Scots receive FREE university education, FREE prescriptions and FREE personal care only because our Southern friends pay for it. Which is ridiculous of course, and only goes to show some don't understand how we run our affairs and make choices re what's in the best interests of the Scottish people.
Alex Salmond is taking a pasting in some sections of the press. Well, he will have expected, and will be prepared, for that. However, what the critics seem to forget is that he was elected to a comfortable majority in 2010--and gave him the mandate to pursue the Independence Referendum on our behalf.
Painting him as some nut-job dictator and figure of ridicule is actually tantamount to dissing ALL the Scots who voted his government in. Very disrespectful.
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Post by ozneil on Feb 18, 2014 18:23:02 GMT -1
I sdee from BBC survey this is a list6 of the most common concerns about independence
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Post by ozneil on Feb 18, 2014 19:07:44 GMT -1
I see the scare campaign is getting into gear with Brown now working on it You guys gonna have to work like buggery to beat the bastards!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2014 19:34:06 GMT -1
I sdee from BBC survey this is a list6 of the most common concerns about independence Well, I'm not sure about the order, Oz, but yes, I think the economy's paramount and broadly speaking I'd agree with that general list, certainly from the conversations I have with family, friends, colleagues and workmates of all ages and backgrounds. I'd agree that immigration, defence and broadcasting bring up the tail end of the coo in most discussions.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2014 19:37:16 GMT -1
I see the scare campaign is getting into gear with Brown now working on it You guys gonna have to work like buggery to beat the bastards! You have a distinct advantage on me there, Oz, cos 10 hours of the day I'm at work so haven't quite caught up with today's doings yet. Suffice to say I believe it's causing no end of grief and disappointment to stalwart Labour voters that their own party leaders and key figures are reading off a Tory script. Independence is all-party and no-party. It's a principle!
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Post by ozneil on Feb 18, 2014 20:03:08 GMT -1
Hell Im just outa bed reading the papers.
Ours are dead boring today so onto UK papers.
Telegraph has a series on Scottish Independence . The Mail has a few lurid pics (some nice looking Sheilas in UK) The Herald with typical Scottish thriftiness want to charge me a few quid to read it!!! They should be paying me!!!!
ps A now ex-union sec here has just been found guilty of misusing union funds to hire prostitutes etc etc ... Guy may be union rep in prison now
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2014 20:08:24 GMT -1
Mayte, if you quit calling me a leftie, I'll share my log in and password to the Herald site. DEAL?
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Post by ozneil on Feb 18, 2014 20:14:58 GMT -1
Mayte, if you quit calling me a leftie, I'll share my log in and password to the Herald site. DEAL? mmm tempting but should I allow my principles to be overcome ROFLMAO Deal I enjoy the Herald Blogger down under... With my usual penchant for name dropping ..... I have forgotten the buggers name
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Post by ozneil on Feb 19, 2014 23:26:01 GMT -1
I see David Bowie has now waded into the debate...... Hes English!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2014 23:17:37 GMT -1
Actually, no he hasn't. He's "debated" nothing! What's interesting is the media coverage today--all over every newspaper and social media outlet. Completely out of proportion He's welcome to his opinion, just like everyone else. But it would be ridiculous to assume he has any influence whatsoever on voting patterns. I have huge respect for David Bowie, he's been a game-changer since the 70s and a serious part of music culture. But I won't be changing my voting intentions because of his 'intervention' and the white noise on social media tonight leads me to believe nobody else will, either! Await the cartoonists over the weekend: Alex Salmond dressed as Ziggy? Chained to a Diamond Dug? All too predictable
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Post by ozneil on Feb 21, 2014 0:06:29 GMT -1
Remind them that it was a Scot that founded the Bank of England James? Patterson? if my memory serves me right
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